I went to work for Bell Labs after undergraduate doing something that was very, it was really software development. And so I was in the group that did processors, computers that ran switching systems, so when you made like your local calls or long distance calls, there's a computer at the center of all that. At the time, they were specialized kind of computers used for nothing else, but they were a computer. So I actually wrote the system software to help those computers run, to do a particular thing with updating from one version of like hardware to another version. And so it was a good job for someone who had software knowledge as well as electrical engineering knowledge. But one of the good things about Bell Labs at the time was when they hired you with a Bachelor's degree, everybody did their master's, that was just part of the program. To be a member of technical staff, you had to have a master's degree and you could either do it one year on campus, OYOC, or OPT or LUPT local university part time. I did the one year on campus. So they paid me to go to Stanford, reduced salary, but still paid me. Stanford had a, still has a one year master's program, and there I did electrical engineering. It was really a split between, you know, kind of electrical and computer kinds of things. And then worked at Bell Labs for a while, and then decided that I really did want to pursue kind of more research and teaching. And went back for my Ph.D. When I wanted to tell my supervisor at the time that I was going back for a Ph.D., this guy also had a Ph.D., he said, "I just have one question for you." He said, you know, "What's your motivation? Why are you doing it?" And I said, well, I really I think I want to teach and education's important, do research and just have that flexibility. He said, "Great, I wish you the best." And he said, "If you had said that you wanted to make more money, [laughs] I would have talked you out of it." [laughs]